Travel, Food & IT with Brook Lee (EP 850)

Hello friends, Uncle Marv here with another episode of the IT Business Podcast, still here day one of PAX 8 Beyond in Denver, Colorado, outside the Vendor Hall. And activity is starting to happen out here. My guest right now, you have heard her on the show many times and had her on earlier this year after a big announcement and have her on again as one of the sponsors, Brooke Lee with Liongard. 

Brooke, how are you? I'm doing good, thank you for having me. Probably my third, maybe fourth time being on your podcast, always a good time. I like them because some people we don't sugarcoat here. 

We give the real truth. If you show up to Uncle Marv's podcast, you better be ready to go, because we're not sugarcoating anything. That's right, and I may ask a question you may not be ready for. 

I've been on this podcast, I'm ready for everything. So of course we're here, PAX 8. I'm having you on the show because you guys are a sponsor. Thank you all for helping with that, helping me to pay for some of my expenses. 

It was not cheap to be out here. It is not cheap to get here, and it's also not cheap to be here or stay here. It's a beautiful facility. 

I really like it. It's lovely, but again, you need to plan early. A lot of us, the hotel sold out so quickly, we're staying sort of like on the outlying hotels. 

Really? There's probably 20 within like a mile and a half, two miles. A lot of the hotels, PAX 8's running shuttles for everybody, so you can catch the shuttle, so you don't need the Uber fee or anything like that. If I wasn't in work clothes, some of these are totally walkable. 

It's absolutely gorgeous outside. It is a beautiful weather. It is good weather, and now I don't feel so bad because I'm stuck on... I'm not in one of the towers. 

I'm in, I guess, the servants quarters alongside where the Uber cars pick up and stuff. So for those of you, if I publish the video, but if you see the podcast cover, we have Leo here, and this is a new version of Leo, isn't it? No, this is the one that I've had since the beginning of the year that I've had. Yeah, but it's not like for public. 

I can't swing by the booth and grab it as swag. So we have a really big lion that we carry with us to the booth. His name is George, and then we have some what I call little baby Leos. 

They're little small stuffed animals that we give out, but I've worked at a couple of other places, and I floated the idea, and nobody really liked it, but I came here to Liongard, and one of the things that I really love about being at Liongard is they are very willing to think differently and think outside the box. So they are the anti of, this is the way that we've always done it. They are all about new ideas, and I said, I have this idea. 

I want to get like a lion mascot. I travel so much. I want to take him with me on the road. 

He has his own Instagram page. We do these posts on LinkedIn, so when I travel somewhere, I will take a picture of him in a location, and the first person that guesses it right on LinkedIn, I send them like some cool swag or something. They can get like coffee on us. 

They can get some Liongard swag. People love it. It's light-hearted. 

It's fun, and I was going to ask about that. I saw that, and I'm like, what are they doing? Is this some sort of 2020 version of Flat Stanley? No. It's Where in the World is Leo? And again, it's just, I don't know. 

There's a lot of bad stuff that goes on our world. There's a lot of stuff on LinkedIn that's really heavy and whatever, and I just thought, we're going to try it and see if it's fun. If it works, great. 

If not, then I'll try something else. It's been really popular. People love it. 

They think it's fun. Some of them people have now taken the baby Leos, and they will post on my post, I've got baby Leo, and I'm here. So it's like, it's definitely sort of spider-webbing out. 

Does this mean I need to start carrying baby Leo with me? You might have to. Because my baby Leo just sits on my bookcase behind me for the show. Yeah, maybe take him with you. 

I mean, you travel too? Go someplace? I don't travel as much as you. Well, you got to get out there, and you got to see the people. You've got to come to the events. 

This is one of the biggest one on the schedule now. Rob Ray says it's the biggest in the world. Okay, well, Rob's saying it's the biggest in the world. 

It might be a stretch, but we know how Rob is. But legitimately, I think this, in our space, this might be the second biggest event now, based on the numbers that I heard from this year. Like, confirmed people are here, checked in. 

This is not the typical, oh, we've got a Ka jillion people coming. This is legitimately the people that are here. I think this is the number two event now in our space. 

Okay, so from a vendor perspective, that's got to sound great. Tons of people, tons of opportunity, but it's a lot of extra work, isn't it? To me, it's no different than any of the other big events, but I think some of the vendors that I feel do better when you're coming to these events, is you've really got to bring people that have actual MSP experience. So when you're hiring, you've got to find those people, because the conversations that those people can have at the booth, whether it's about your product, whatever issues that they've got going on, how you can help them, because you've been there and done that, that will help you resonate so much better with those MSPs. 

So that way, when I tell them, this is not a me thing, this is a Marv thing, let me walk you over, find Marv, let me introduce you. He's got what you need to fix this problem. That is what makes these events what I enjoy so much, because what I talk to at a guy in Omaha, he's a five-man shop, and then I come here to this big show, and I hear a guy and he's telling me he's got a problem, and I'm like, I literally heard that last week, and we talked it through, and this is one of the ways that we came up to solve that problem. 

Let me share that with you. So I like the fact that that happens a lot, and to be honest, that's probably one of the reasons that I signed up with LionGuard. We weren't supposed to do pitching, but the fact that I wanted to hear more, but I wanted to hear from an MSP. 

I didn't want to hear from a salesperson. And that's something that when I first joined LionGuard, because I've worked at a couple of other, you know, software vendors that have, I mean, there was like, I was one of one or one of three of people that had any MSP experience there. Like, we have tons of people that work at LionGuard that used to work at an MSP, and I was like, we really need to showcase that more, because that is few and far between, and then it's like, when I'm asking you to do an onboarding, I know what I'm asking you to do. 

I know what I'm asking your people to do. I know what I'm asking you as an MSP to give up. I need to borrow your tier three. 

I'm going to have to have your tier two to do this. We're going to have to integrate. I know what the time constraints are, as well as training your people, because we've got to get the buy-in. 

So that's why I think it's, and that's also, you and I had talked about when it's how to choose a vendor. If you can find a vendor that has people there that have MSP experience, and know what it's going to take to do however big the lift is, or is not, to implement that particular software, that's something, those are the questions, the hard questions as an MSP that you need to be asking those vendors, and if they can't answer them, then you need to go to the next. So your concept of how to choose a vendor, I want to ask you this, is it something that other vendors have commended you on? Have they not said anything? Have they avoided you? Well, I mean, people may avoid me, and I just don't know, and I don't know if it's because I have the how to choose a vendor thing, but for me, it's because I've been in the MSP shoes, and now, because I've seen behind the curtain, and I know what happens, you need to ask the really tough questions. 

What legitimately is it going to take for me to implement the software? Is it two weeks? Is it six weeks? Is it 12 weeks? What does the training look like? What are the costs really look like? If I want you to support 30% of my clients now, and then I end up meeting, I really like the platform, and I'm going to go to 80%, what does that mean for me price-wise? Am I going to get some price breaks? And again, I want, those are the questions again, and those are hard questions, but any vendor that you choose, you are partnering with this person. You are now married to this person for the long term, and you need to ask those hard questions up front, so you can decide if you want to get married or not. Yeah, but that's not the way best practice vendors have been told. 

It's all about the sale. Get the sale. Get the sale.

Get the sale. That's what's been done in the past, and that's the way everybody does it. I don't, again, I think that's a, I don't think that's the best way to choose a software platform when you were an MSP, because again, you're going to be married to this person for the long haul. 

We don't put in a software platform, and then three months later, we're like, yeah, we don't like that. We want to get something else. We are going to be in this for like a while, so you've really got to make sure that you have a good partnership. 

Make sure that they have, they offer training on the regular. I tell people all the time, you should be getting the vendors to train your new employees on the software. I need you to have some sort of an educational program, an onboarding program, so when I have new employees come in, let them, let me teach you LionGuard, and then once I've taught you LionGuard, then you can go learn sort of the intricacies of it at your MSP. 

Let me do the heavy lifting and teach you the product and have the MSP not use their time doing that. So, you know, I've had this discussion before, so I'm in agreement with you. I've been talking about this MSP slash vendor etiquette thing for a while, and it's been behind the scenes. 

Nobody really wants to talk about it publicly, and I've had surveys on the website. I've had, I've actually gotten more responses than I thought I would. Really? Okay. 

Now, what are you seeing? It's, it's very interesting because I'm actually, what this survey does, and I probably will, you know, put this in the link so that because we're talking about it, still do it. I'm actually getting some very specific instances of, you know, what has happened because usually you get the, you know, the MSP complains that, oh, when I get back from a conference, all I get is sales calls. Well, that's to be expected, but in this case, we're actually getting those types of sales calls where, yeah, I got a sales call. 

I wasn't worried about the call because I was expecting the call. Okay. But I wasn't expecting to be treated the way I was, and it really is starting to dig into where, because a lot of times a person that makes the call was not the person at the, at the event.

Okay. And publicly, people have started to say, okay, stop lying to me when you say, hey, you know, and I'll use it from my perspective because this happens to us. I won't rat anybody out. 

Yeah, yeah. So somebody will call my office. Kim will answer the phone. 

Okay. And somebody will say, hey, yeah, had a great discussion with Marvin at the booth, and he's really interested in our product. Oh, that's a hard pass. 

That's a no. And Kim will be like, yeah, that doesn't sound like Marvin. Yeah. 

And, but, so the survey, I've actually gotten more specific than that. I use that because that's happened to us, and I've publicly said that, but we're starting to get those things where, you know, a vendor will make a comment, oh, yeah, we looked at it, we're not interested, and then the, you know, the response in the call will be, well, how do you intend to grow? Oh, that's rude. And it's, it's a question that's like a slap in the face. 

That's. As if, you know, you can't grow without us, sort of a thing. That's, yeah, that's, that's a hard pass for me. 

Yeah, so I'm starting to get those comments, and so I'm actually getting conversations, because now I want to hear more, because I don't want to just respond to that without the proper context. Was, you know, people having a bad day? What was going on? But then I'm also getting where vendors are saying, look, part of the reason we're the way that we are is because you come to our booth, you take our stuff, you sign up for an interview, and then you don't show up. Yeah, so I mean, I get that, like, because people come by, and they want to get all the swag. 

Okay, fine, we bring the swag for the people, but when you sign up for a demo, which is what a lot of us call it, or an introductory call, so that's sort of the shift that we've started. I've seen us and a lot of other vendors start doing that, and I think that's a good thing. So instead of doing the full-blown demo on the first go round, we do like an intro call, so it's just sort of, let's touch base, hey, and also, I am really big on notes. 

A lot of people are not, so I will put a note in there, hey, I talked to Marv, he's not ready, just shoot him an email once a month, so that way no one will call you. If it's somebody that I talked to, yep, I talked to Marv, he wants you to give him a call, let's get something set up, let's just do the 15-minute intro to see what do you exactly have going on, do we think we're going to be a good fit? If we are, then let's schedule the next one with like the four other people that you're going to need, but I always tell people in 15 minutes or less, but if I'm booking you in for a demo, and again, this is where I think that MSP experience comes in, I know, A, if you're actually going to show up, and B, if this is going to be a good fit for you. I had a, I was at, was it Rite of Boom? I was at Rite of Boom this year, and two gentlemen came up to me, they were co-owners of an MSP, and they were like, Brooke, we really want to talk to you about Liongard, we're really, you know, we're jacked up, we're excited, we want to go ahead and buy it, da-da-da, I'm like, well, what, you know, what do you boys got going on? What's, you know, what do you have going on to MSP? These two gentlemen were literally in the middle of doing, they were moving from one PSA to another, and they were moving their RMM, and I told them, look, I don't know you boys from Adam, but what I'm not going to do right now is I'm not selling you Liongard, because you will not be successful. 

You are in the middle of the two biggest lifts possible, and you need to get that done first. I said, what I'm going to do is I'm going to scan your little badges, I'm going to put a note in here, and I'm going to have somebody call you boys in about six months, and we're going to see where the dust has settled and everything else, but, and again, another person may have been like, great, let's book it, let's sign it, let's get the agreement, but I know for a fact, these two gentlemen and their MSP, you are not going to be successful with Liongard right now. Absolutely not. 

You're not going to use it, you're going to pay me a monthly bill, because you're in the middle of these two other things. You're having those conversations and making sure, even if your MSP is ready for growth or whatever, are we aligned timing-wise? Is this something where you kind of got something else going on? You got some really big projects going? Do I just need to have somebody reach out in three months? I put a note in there. Marv is in the middle of three major projects right now. 

He wants us, but we cannot do this right at this time. Call him in three months. Send him an email, let him know we got your stuff, we're going to give you a call in three months. 

That's where I think that vendor, MSP, best practices, etiquette, I think that's a piece of the puzzle. That's a piece of it, and the fact that you take notes, and I'm assuming those notes go into a very good CRM that your callers look at and read, because I did have that discussion with somebody too, is what's going into that CRM after the show, or is somebody just sending in a cell spreadsheet of here's all the scans we had, go get them? And again, I will say this depends on how the vendor operates. So anybody that books a demo, those are people that at LionGuard we have actually talked to. 

I know that they have a need. I know that this can fix part of the problem. I know that right now they have the capacity to be able to talk to us. 

This isn't new. They don't have 50 other things going on, and that we can make this work. If I scan somebody, and I don't book a demo with them, this is somebody that has either told me, Brooke, I mean, I'm interested, but maybe just, you know, shoot me some emails, and I stick firm to that. 

I put a note in there. Uncle Mark doesn't want to talk to us right now. He just wants an email once a month, and I make sure all we do is send you an email once a month. 

And then again, if something piques your interest, then you, hey Brooke, I saw this email about some, you guys got some new stuff going on. You got LionGuard IQ. I really want to talk about that. 

Have somebody give me a call. Have somebody give you a call. Again, I think that's the etiquette that has to happen.

Talking of etiquette, I don't know what they're doing over there. My goodness. All right, so we kind of, I don't know if we swerved off track or whatever, but this is why I love your podcast. 

You can talk about anything and everything under the sun. You never know what you're going to talk about. I appreciate that. 

So, so you're here, big event. Let me ask, let's lighten it up a little bit. Did you come in early and do any hiking like everybody else? This girl is not a hiker. 

I am not hiking anywhere. No, sir. Really? But I did come in early, got in early, and there is a really cool restaurant. 

I don't come, this is the only reason I come to Denver is for this event. I don't, there's hardly any other events out here. There is an amazing restaurant downtown called Bao Brewhouse. 

I found it. I'm sorry. Bao, B-A-O. 

Oh, okay. It's sort of an Asian street food fusion kind of thing going on, but it's one of those where it's the shared plates. I've been here three times now, and every time I come, I try to take somebody different because I love it so much. 

So there's a young lady that works with us. Her name is Britt. She does all of our events, like our Roarcon, internal, external. 

She's got stuff going on right now. Some of our group is over in San Diego. She's handling this stuff here. 

So I took her, and then you remember Renee that I worked with at PIA? Yeah. She's at PAX 8 now. So we took her, coached me. 

Britt and Renee, we went downtown, and we had some food, had some drinks, and had a good time. Yeah, Renee was afraid to talk to me. What's she want? I don't know.

Well, she's like that. She's high up at PAX 8 now. She's like senior, senior VP of something.

Oh, I'll never talk to her. She doesn't have time to talk to me anymore, either. All right, so you get this restaurant. 

So it's, so like you specifically, that's the restaurant. If there's, if you're in Denver, go to this Bao what? Bao Brewhouse. Bao Brewhouse. 

B-A-O. It's downtown, but again, it's funky, it's eclectic, but I really like it, and the space that it's in, if you get down there, there's lots of other little like coffee shops, locally owned places you can like walk around, and it's like a very walkable space down there. There's a couple places, towns that I go to, I just have favorite places. 

Chicago is one of my all-time favorite cities in America. I absolutely love it, and I tell people there is a Starbucks there, and everybody rolls their eyes. Starbucks, Starbucks, Starbucks everywhere.

There is a Starbucks everywhere. However, this is a Starbucks reserve. It is five stories. 

It is an experience, and I'm literally a tour guide now. Every time I go, I take somebody new with me, and we go through all of the things. They have specialty drinks there you can only get at that Starbucks, and they have a rooftop viewing area where you can take your coffee and go upstairs and look over all of downtown Chicago. 

So Starbucks reserve in Chicago is to Starbucks what Gaylord is to hotels. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. 

That is what it is. Five stories. Again, it's an amazing experience, and they bake their own bread, and they have an oven that the bread rotates through the entire five floors. 

Like you watch the oven go around, and the bread proofs, and it bakes, and it does all these things. It's amazing. They obviously grind their own beans there.

How did you find out about this? I was just walking around. What? Well, I love to walk. When I go to cities, that is not a food channel thing you saw. 

No, sir. I'm a walker. Are you a foodie? I am. 

Really? Absolutely. We've not had that discussion. Absolutely. 

I love good food, but I like anything and everything, and like one of the best hot dogs that I've ever had was in Nashville at a Robin Robbins event. We had been at her after-party. It was about 2 o'clock in the morning. 

I got one from a food cart. I was sitting on the curb on the side of the street drinking a beer, having a hot dog. Best hot dog I've ever had. 

Okay, is that like the only time to enjoy a hot dog? Somewhere between 2 and 4 in the morning after drinking? Maybe. I don't think I've ever had a good hot dog. This was a good hot dog.

This was maybe almost like a brat level hot dog. This was not just like you know the Red Dye No. 7 hot dog. 

This was a really good hot dog. So it was a big meaty dog? Yeah, yeah, nice. And again, we had been out for like a really long time, and we're literally sitting there on the side of the road. 

Okay, you hold up your hands like a big football type thing? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And we got some chili cheese fries that trip for a gentleman that was working with us from Australia. He had never had chili cheese fries before. 

He was like, this is the best thing ever made. And I'm like, this is literally like artery clogging, and you're going to have a stomachache tomorrow. But he was absolutely in love with the chili cheese fries. 

Wow. Wow. Okay, so now I know we need to chat every time I see you in the city, so I can find out where to go eat. 

The best stuff. Vancouver is probably my best city for sushi. They have the best sushi I have ever had in my life.

Really? Absolutely. Hands down. Another very walkable city as well. 

How would you remember? How much sushi have you had? A lot. Now, I don't, I do not eat conference sushi. I don't eat grocery store sushi, and I don't eat any sort of sushi on an airplane. 

But some of it is because I walk a lot, and I have it, I like to do like the pub hops. You meet local people when you go to these little bitty local pubs. I stay out of the really big ones. 

I don't go to the chains. You meet amazing people from the cities that you're in. You have these conversations, and I'm like, oh, I really like this. 

And they're like, oh, you need to go down here two blocks, turn right. You'd never find it. Of course not. 

It's not going to be whatever. But you go down there, you have really great food, and you meet more amazing people. So you strike me as somebody that could just walk in somewhere by yourself, meet people, and within 24 hours, you're like best friends with half the town.

I've got friends for life. Happens to me every time I go to Europe. Every time.

Really? Love those guys over there. Again, because I'm not, A, they're not used to seeing some girl looking like me coming from America to this really like, it's a sketchy looking bar. But again, you meet the most amazing people. 

Absolutely just, and I've never, I've traveled for probably a solid two and a half years now, two, three years in the channel space. Never had a bad experience. Never had any of the people that were not super welcoming. 

I buy around, they buy around. Now they love the girl from America. Again, I've literally, knock on wood, never had a bad experience. 

Wow. And met really, really good people. So if there was one place, one town, one person that you would say, you need to go here, you need to go to this place, you need to meet this person, who would it be? One town, one place, one person. 

Yeah. So I would say there is a small town in England called Maidenhead. It's a little bitty town. 

Everybody was like, there's nothing good happening in this town. Went out and walked around and there was a little pub and there was a lovely lady running said pub. She used to be a dancer of the exotic type and she now runs this bar and she's retired from the dancing. 

She has the best stories I have ever heard. She was absolutely loving. It was, we stayed there for hours. 

She was, it was the most welcoming environment and I love listening to stories and she has great stories to tell. She can pour a mean pint of Guinness. And again, it was probably one of the best, it was rainy, it was gross, it was whatever. 

Had the best night ever. Again, small town. And I told people, I was like, y'all got to go to this bar.

And they were like, what? Maidenhead? I was like, I know. Really great people there. So we've got to venture out. 

People lived in that town that didn't know what I was talking about. So you guys have got to, you got to venture out a little bit. You got to get out of your comfort zone. 

Got to go try some new stuff. Do you know anybody that has gone? After you referred them? They did not go. They're not going to leave. 

They're not going to go outside their comfort zone. Of course. I would love to hear a story of somebody that you referred and they actually did it.

I'll have to think about that. Because I don't, a lot of times we go to these events, and a lot of times they're not in the same place, which is one of the really great things about it is I get to go to different places and meet different people. Like this year, I'm in with a particular peer group called Network Group. 

They're based out of sort of like the UK and I region. And I do a lot of those this year. They have some tracks that they're doing, which I absolutely love. 

So I tell people, there's been a big shift in the channel, as far as it's definitely veered far away from the sales side, and it's now much more on the education side. So each quarter, they're doing a different track. So the first quarter was more on like leadership. 

Second quarter was on marketing. And this third quarter is on service. So I was all geeking out about that. 

I'm ready to go. I submitted like seven sessions. I'm like ready to rock. 

I'm teaching two sessions over there doing a roundtable. But that particular group, their Q4 event is in Belfast. And I've never been there before. 

And I'm really excited to go. All right. Well, I'm going to have to scale my MSP so I can make some money and hire some people so I can go visit these places.

Absolutely. Well, I'll drag you along and ask anybody if you walk with me and I keep saying it's only five more minutes. It's really not. 

But I'm a looker. That's what I'm saying. I'm just like, it's only five more minutes. 

It's only five more minutes. I've got a lot of people that will not walk with me anymore. JP Kesey is here. 

I was with him and his wife in Berlin. They will never walk with me ever again. Britt that I work with, we were in Vegas trying to get to somewhere. 

She will probably never walk with me ever again. And then Coach and Joe, I was with them one time in Phoenix. They will probably never walk with me ever again. 

But yeah, just put on your, if I say we're going to go, we're going to walk, we're going to go something, make sure you got good, good, comfortable shoes on. So Lynn from ASCII tries that on me and I'm like, no, we're not. You'll have to ask her. 

We were in an event in Atlanta about some shuffleboard. We played shuffleboard at a bar and Brad Gross was there and there was another guy there from NUSO and Brad and the guy from NUSO said, we are like shuffleboard champions. I was like, all right, we'll get it. 

And I'm super competitive. Lynn and I beat him both. We took pictures. 

Oh yeah. We were talking trash to Brad the whole night. I posted pictures on it. 

I'm like, Brad, I'm going to go right to his booth. You should be done. You ask him, do you remember that time that you played Lennon Brook and shuffleboard in Atlanta and he's going to be, he'll immediate eye roll, whatever. 

It's going to turn into a whole thing. I'm sure he'll have some excuse. He will. 

Absolutely. We beat the living, you know what, out of those two boys. It was great. 

Lynn and I, I mean, we were trash talking the whole time. It was absolutely a good time. Oh my. 

Wow. Well, Brooke, we're out of time. Yes, sir. 

Thank you for having me. It was a great conversation. So I love doing your podcast. 

They're random. You never know what you're going to talk about. And listen, we talked some tech and we talked some Liongard. 

Thank you guys again for being a sponsor. Absolutely. Always happy to do that.

Thank you guys for the way that you run the business. I saw Michelle. She's doing great things. 

I got to meet Joe at some point. You got to meet Joe and Vin, the two co-founders. Those two guys, they're wicked smart and they're so humble about it.

Wicked smart. Wicked smart. Joe and Vin are so passionate about Liongard and about what we do and about helping people. 

And I tell people that's one of the reasons I came here to work at Liongard. When you work for people like that, it's not work. When everybody's excited about what you're doing.

So, yeah, you've got to meet Joe. You've got to meet Vin. Some of the other people on the team, again, we've got a really, really good group of people. 

It's a solid group. We're all just, again, the excitement and the passion for it. I've never seen it before anywhere I've worked. 

It's really hard not to get excited when you come here and you meet the people. All right. I will look out for that. 

Get me to a war con. And we got another one coming up in September. That first one we did so well.

We got another one. Where's the September one? It's going to be in Houston again. That's where our headquarters is at.

West of the Mississippi. But the event was great and the venue is lovely and the hotel was amazing. We had so much fun.

This is my event. West of the Mississippi. Well, you just have to just scoot over just a little bit further. 

I promise you'll have a good time. We had a great time. I don't scoot. 

You do the boot scooting boogie. Yeah, you could just scoot over just a little bit more. Brooke, thank you for stopping by.

Yes, sir. And folks, this was a fill in. She did not plan to be here. 

And I thought we were interviewing somebody else. I won't tell you what happened but thank you very much. Yes, sir. 

Great conversation as per usual. And we'll do it again soon. Yes, sir. 

Thank you for having me. All right, folks. We'll be back.

I think I've got one more interview here on day one at PAX 8 Beyond. We'll see you soon. Holla.